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Re: Redboot in a Router


On Fri, 2005-09-23 at 17:28 +0100, Jonathan Larmour wrote:
> Andrew Potter wrote:
> > Hi folks,
> > 
> > 	A couple of questions regarding Redboot.
> > 
> > 	I have an Inventel manufactured Livebox ADSL Modem/Router that uses
> > Redboot.
> > 
> > 	As I understand it, this software is released under a GPL compatible
> > license and this means that Inventel must release the source code for
> > every version of Redboot  used in the Livebox to me (as I have a Livebox
> > and they have released a binary of it in a firmware update) if I request
> > it. Is this true ?
> 
> Since they didn't supply source with the product, they must include a 
> written offer to supply the source, as per GPL clause 3. If there was no 
> such offer, that is already a violation.
> 
> You, and in fact anyone, is entitled to the GPL covered source code for 
> any binary containing GPL'd code, if it didn't already come with sources. 
> Which is indeed the case here.
> 
> So, in other words.... yes :).
> 
> > 	I have tried requesting the source code for the version used in this
> > router from Inventel but have not had any response from them.
> > 	If the above is true, is there anything else that can be done to get
> > Inventel to release the source ?
> 
> I assume you have given them a reasonable time to respond, and approached 
> the correct e-mail address? May I suggest looking at 
> http://ecos.sourceware.org/ml/ecos-patches/2002-11/msg00082.html and 
> talking to that guy directly. He may be more receptive.
> 
> Failing that, write a letter, by which I mean a physical one. E-mail is 
> not a formal means of communication in many countries unfortunately. Tell 
> them that you have informed the copyright holders (of which I am one) and 
> that the copyright holders are also awaiting Inventel's response to you 
> with interest.
> 
> If it's reached the stage of writing a letter (rather that talking to 
> Xavier Debreuil) then you might consider upping the ante by highlighting 
> to them section 4 of the GPL:
> 
> "  4. You may not copy, modify, sublicense, or distribute the Program
> except as expressly provided under this License.  Any attempt
> otherwise to copy, modify, sublicense or distribute the Program is
> void, and will automatically terminate your rights under this License."
> 
> In other words... if they do not comply, they will be forced to withdraw 
> *and recall* their product entirely.
> 
> But to be honest, I suspect more cock-up than conspiracy. Ignorance of the 
> GPL requirements is the usual reason for non-compliance. There's probably 
> no need to go out all guns blazing yet.
> 
> Note that they may well have published some of their patches on the 
> ecos-patches list, as evinced by the above link. But that still doesn't 
> absolve them of their obligations to give you the offer to obtain the 
> source code. BTW, note that due to the special GPL exception clause with 
> eCos, they are only required to provide code directly or indirectly 
> derived from eCos/RedBoot. This may or may not be the code used to 
> generate the entire binary.
> 
> > 	My understanding based on a response from Harald Welte (laforge at
> > gnumonks dot org ) and reading his gpl-violations.org website is that
> > the copyright holder would have to be the one to enforce their copyright
> > in France. If this is true, can the copyright owner request Inventel to
> > release the source ?
> 
> Ultimately yes, if necessary by going to court. That's very expensive and 
> best avoided if it can be done by another route. But anyone can approach 
> them and "remind" them of their legal obligations.
> 
> Please let ecos-maintainers [@] ecos.sourceware.org know how you get on.

Do you know what version of eCos/RedBoot is used in this router?
It is possible, albeit remote, that it uses a pre-GPL licensed
version of eCos, in which case the GPL protection above does not
apply.

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------
Gary Thomas                 |  Consulting for the
MLB Associates              |    Embedded world
------------------------------------------------------------


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